slippahs

Just read through the last 187 posts. Booked a stay here in July for three nights. The room description reads: "Room Description Superior, Heavenly King Bed & Bath, Ave Size:28m2." Any way of knowing whether this is a renovated or a unrenovated room? Or is it a luck of the draw?

SportsTech

I'm taking a group of 8 adults to stay at the Westin Kyoto this weekend (3 night stay) I've booked 5 rooms, 3 on points/ 2 paid. I'm the only one with Plat status. Does anyone have a recent stay report regarding the renovations - are they all done? Any advice on floors to request or avoid? And, most important, a contact I could email to plead for non-smoking rooms? Thanks! ST

Starwood Lurker II

Hi SportsTech,

Request for all non-smoking rooms might be granted upon availability during check in. I have sent you a PM with the details you need.

Thank you and have a nice day!

[email protected]

b8b

Any recent stay experiences? We are planning a stay on points in an room with executive priveledges.

Is this the easiest and least expensive way to get from KIX to the Kyoto Westin? About how much might I spend per person (two adults, two kids)?

Is the JR Rail pass worth it then?

I'm debating whether to stay in Osaka or Kyoto... we'll arrive into KIX and be in the region for 5 days with kids and want to make the most of it. I'm afraid it will be very hot in mid June. Should we stay in Kyoto or Osaka?

Thanks!

SportsTech

SPG Plat, stayed last week for 3 nights, 3 rooms (2 on points, 1 paid). No suite offered for any of the 3 rooms. Rooms were all ok, not remarkable; hotel is in a good location, and very clean & neat, but not a lot of personality IMO. Hotel seemed to be fairly heavily booked, so we may well have gotten the "best available room" at check-in. Restaurants are expensive, even for Japan; there are many good, and more affordable, options in town.

No advice on KIX transport but I'm guessing the ubiquitous Japan Railway (or one of the local lines) would be easy and affordable. We flew into NGO, took the Shinkansen to Kyoto station, and the (free) shuttle bus from the station to the hotel. It takes about half an hour on the bus.

schriste

Personally I’d stay in Kyoto rather than commute from Osaka. It is very easy to spend 5 days just in Kyoto. If you plan to cram sightseeing from the Kansai region into your 5 days (day in Nara, day in Osaka, day to castle in Himeji, etc) then staying in Osaka will make sense.

As for JR Pass if you only plan on staying in the Kansai region then a “regular” JR pass will not make sense. JR West sells a “Kansai Area Pass” that can be purchased in Japan at the airport. You can purchase for 1, 2 ,3, or 4 days (2,000,4000,5,000, 6,000 yen respectively, half price for kids). This will include the limited express train from KIX to Kyoto so is a very good value. There is also a private railway version called the Kansai Thru Pass. This is good on almost everything that moves in the Kansai region EXCEPT for JR lines. The plus of this is it is good on subways and local buses plus some funiculars as well as the private railways (and there are many of these with comprehensive coverage of Kansai). Downside is the journey from KIX will be more complicated and require more changes than using the JR service.

I rather like the Westin Kyoto and do feel it has an interesting personality. But it is a large hotel with many sections built in different times… and renovated at different times. Hence, there is a very wide variety of rooms available here. The executive rooms should be fairly nice as a rule.

b8b

Very informative, thank you.^

Is the Westin Osaka or Kyoto nicer to stay in (executive rooms)?

How should determine which pass is better for us, the “Kansai Area Pass” or Kansai Thru Pass? I assume I must choose one or the other, and I would like to use it to get from KIX to/near the Westin in Osaka (might as well take the train there instead of the limo bus if we have a pass, right? Trying to minimize expenditures) or the Westin Kyoto. We haven't decided which Westin to stay at yet, we're in the area 5 days, and we'd like to see Osaka and Kyoto and anywhere else that is a must-see, and if we have a rail pass to do it, we might be motivated to go further around the Kansai region. Is either the JR or the private trains less packed? I'd like be able to enjoy the ride too, if possible

Is it hot and humid in mid June? This table makes it sound like it is not too bad.

You response is not only much appreciated, but I will be basing my travel plans on it, so thank you once again.

SanDiego1K

The Japan forum on FT is very strong, with posters highly knowledgeable about train travel. You might find it useful to post the travel portion of your question there.

schriste

The Westin in Osaka is a conventional city hotel located in a high rise building near the main JR station (about a 10-15 minute walk). It is located on the back side of the JR station, so is in a bit of an out of the way location. The good side of this is the rooms facing the train station have a great view of the Osaka skyline and you can watch the truly amazing frequency of trains coming and going. I last stayed there 2 years ago and at that time the rooms were a bit on the dated side… but still well kept and spotless. A nice hotel, but will be a bit of a disappointment if you are coming from say some of the new top end hotels in Tokyo. Compared to a regular US Westin… it is a great hotel. The executive rooms have a slightly different décor, higher floor, and fancier toiletries, but the same floor plan as regular rooms… there is of course also a lounge.

The Westin in Kyoto is IMHO in a good location if you plan on staying primarily in Kyoto (The immediate area around the hotel is not especially great as such, but you can set out on foot from the hotel for many of the sites in Kyoto. If you plan on using the hotel as a base for other regional travel, then you will be spending at least an extra hour a day getting to and from the Kyoto Station… so obviously less desirable. As I mentioned before the range of rooms here is extremely variable. The executive rooms should be fairly nice and the lounge is also nice with a great view of Kyoto, but it is fairly small and can occasionally get full…. but I rather like it… much more so than the Osaka Westin lounge.

As for the local train passes, please do a search on the web as there are maps available showing what is included in each pass. The Kansai Thru Pass (The private railway version) is by far the most comprehensive, but it is only available in a 2 or 3 day version (note the days do not need to be consecutive). So it is possible for you to buy a 3 day Kansai Thru Pass and also a 1 or 2 day JR Kansai Area Pass. This might be a good choice if you stay in Kyoto as the JR Haruka Limited Express is by far the easiest way to get to Kyoto. If you opt for Osaka then you might want to go for the Kansai Thru Pass. You can take the Nankai railways to Namba station in Osaka and then transfer to the Osaka City Subway to Osaka Station. Note that regular fares on some of the private railways on major routes are not that high, so you may not even need a pass. For example a fare on the Hankyu line from Kyoto to Osaka is only 390 yen.

As for services… The JR Rapid service on the main Kyoto-Osaka-Kobe-Himeji corridor will offer the fastest service. This corridor is also served by multiple private railways that depart from different stations… so it kind of depends on what you are trying to do as to which is the most convenient. In all cases the frequency of trains on the main lines is stunning. No need for a timetable as you will almost never have to wait more than 10 minutes maximum. Japan has the best transit system in the world… by far. Trains are almost always fairly full, but getting a seat should not be impossible on most routes outside of rush hour. Some of the Osaka City subway lines tend to be packed at all times and truly sardine conditions during rush hour.

BTW, if you get a Kansai Thru Pass consider a trip to Koyasan (supplement payable for limited express train)

I just returned from Tokyo 3 days ago and it was already humid (but not that hot). I’d say plan on hot an humid for June.

b8b

Thank you for the excellent information, schriste!

Ah, thank you SanDiego1K, I will try to figure out how to do that without cross posting after I do some more research and try to get my own answers as much as possible.

We have decided to stay at the Westin in Kyoto, thanks to all for the feedback here on FT (especially yours, schriste, thank you!)

b8b

I have some information on the pool:

Staying guest can enjoy fitness center and swimming pool with no charge,
and children also can also enjoy for free.

The depth of pool is around 110cm (indoor pool).
In summer season (after June 1, depending on weather/temperature), outdoor pool also open. the depth is 50 to 88cm.

I'm trying to figure out if the kids are allowed in the indoor pool or just the outdoor pool - I am getting conflicting information from the property assistant manager (who confirmed they are allowed them in both) and our own dear Mr. Thyetus Lee who has asked the property in two languages and told him that kids were only allowed in the outdoor pool, which opens July 1.

Here's a PDF showing the available SPG Instant Awards... thought that my be useful to FT'ers

According to the front desk response to my email inquiry on bike rentals:

"We have 6 bicycles,
2 for mountain bike 2000yen per day-- (between 8:00am and 6:00pm)
4 for normal bike 1500yen per day--( (between 8:00am and 6:00pm)

You can reserve by Email in advance if you tell me the date when you would like to use."

GVA

We checked in here yesterday after a night at the Hyatt Kyoto. The Hyatt was small, friendly and extremely attentive (will post on that hotel in the Hyatt forum).

After arriving at the Westin from the Hyatt with two suitcases, the taxi driver was somewhat surprised that there was no bellboy/porter to take our baggage. That came about 30 seconds after whilst I was still paying the taxi driver. I didn't particularly mind and thought it was only due to the high volumes (full hotel).

Arriving at the front desk there were six agents on service. One of them was free and I proceeded towards her rather than the SPG line. As a platinum I was looking forward to this hotel as the pictures genuinely made it look nice. The lobby itself was acceptable and definately one of the plus points of this hotel.

However, upon checkin, I discovered the worse service I have seen in years, and I was surprised seeing that this is Japan. The young lady got our stay duration wrong (stay booked on spg.com), did not notice any of our preferences. I asked about an upgrade ("do you have upgrade?"), to which she replied "yes upgrade". After that she proceeded to tell me that my rate did not include a breakfast, I was taken aback and told her that I was an SPG platinum member. My name had been pre-printed on a standard welcome pack versus platinum which also showed how poorly the hotel monitored what plats were staying in its hotel that night. Upon telling her that I was SPG Plat, she literally went "ohhhhh, aaah." Obviously unware of this, she got two of her colleagues to come over and they spent a good five minutes talking and typing without offering a jist of an apology. No room change was given and a simple "no upgrade, full" was told to us. Some confusion ensued and she told us to come back the following day for an upgrade.

After a good 15 minutes just standing infront of her and in Japanese style being polite, we were told to wait for the bell-boy to show us to our room (keys and baggage left on the side). Another ten minutes proceeded and it took a reminder to front desk that we were still not on our way. There also no apology and it took a few more minutes before a bell-boy came.

His English was extremely poor and his demeanor was uncomfortable and generally very indifferent. We went up to the 8th floor, and despite my preferences stating near an elevator, we were at the opposite end of the hotel (what a long walk!) on a floor which reeked. Once in our room we both looked at each other at the same time noticing the horrible stench of smoke (really unbearable) and the bell boy continued to tell us it was our imagination until we insisted and he radioed down for a room change. We were brought down to the 5th floor (standard room, refurbished) where there was no smell but the amenities lacked (no bathrobes, old tv, tables falling apart). Nonetheless, standard bed and heavenly shower there.

We went up to the executive lounge to check spg.com (as I did not believe the full hotel due to previous reports here), it turned out that the hotel was full. However, getting onto the lounge's PC was a challenge as it was password protected and the lounge attendant needed to type it in. I waited 15 minutes as she served several Japanese clients having arrived before and after me. After telling her my 5th floor room number she promptly replied (after checking her PC) "you not allowed to be here, leave". Decidedly annoyed, I replied in polite Japanese style and let her know about my SPG Plat status to which she didn't say anything as in the meantime I had left the lounge.

Today, asking for a room change, we really had another debate with the same lady and a deluxe room on the 8th floor was given. It is ok, but really nothing more than what you would see in a standard room in the US.

Some positives, though, the housekeeping are brilliant and service the rooms twice per day (including new towels, soap, etc...) at turn down service. Those employees also scrub on their hands and knees and are pleasant. They really don't deserve to work for a hotel which lets them down in service.

The executive lounge, is small and noisy. The lounge attendant is moody, indifferent and has patronized me on a few occassions. The hors d'oeuvres are pretty much non-existant and when they are out are snatched within seconds but no food is out for 20-25 minutes. They ran out of plates and did not excuse themselves for it, even worse one of the girl's who serves does not speak English and could not understand my request for a plate (even when pointing at one and making gestures). Outside of the cocktail time (530-730) there is only water, orange juice and coffee/tea.

The management really don't care and your status and you being there really do not mean anything.

I definately won't be back here but will stay at the Hyatt Kyoto if I come back here where the service is really the opposite deal. Unfortunately, this hotel is my biggest dissapointment since many years.

b8b

I am staying here now and will do a full trip report later (good and bad), but I have to respond to this since I have been in the lounge every evening for almost the full two hours (who can pass up free beer/wine! lol) for the last 4 nights: only on the weekend has the lounge been noisy (lots of Japanese). I have yet to see the food not be replenished immediately if it is out or even close to out (There are two attendants). If I have a request (I asked for a different cheese, for example), if they don't understand my English, they run and get someone who does. Typical Japanese service: they really want to please. There's one warm food item, and a few cold selections along with two fruits (fresh cut Kiwi and Pineapple). Plenty of booze, red and white wine (both fairly good), 3 different Japanese beers, coke and ginger ale in a glass bottle, Evian water in a glass bottle. There are pastries during the some parts of the day, in addition to an espresso machine that fresh grinds the beans (pretty good), water and orange juice.

This isn't as nice as the Tokyo Westin's executive lounge, but it's still pretty good; the service and the views are excellent. The hotel IS full (G8 in Osaka and it is/was a weekend). I didn't smell anything on the 8th floor, but I'm staying on the 11th.

more later...

GVA

Well some final remarks about this hotel:

-I asked for a 4pm checkout this morning at the executive lounge. The lady there was barely understandable, but said 1PM. Fair enough, except there was still availability and she wanted to charge me 33% of the room rate if I wanted to stay until 4PM. I didn't push it as the hotel is admittedly my least preferred part of a breath taking city, although once again it was against SPG Plat benefits.
-The concierge is extremely friendly and useful, she gave me the information I wanted and even more which made for lovely trips.
-The views from the hotel are nice, especially from the lounge when the sun sets.
-8th floor smell is really only present when you get to the very end of the wing where my first room had been. Other than that, they put us back on the 8th floor last night right by the elevator where there was no smell. That deluxe room didn't have a heavenly shower or bed. Some of the furnishings had been renovated, others hadn't. It was all perfectly acceptable and the balcony was nice also. Room wise, the upgraded rooms are fine. Anything standard (and especially non renovated) will probably not match most people's standards.
-Checkout was average in speed (not fast or slow), the person at the front desk was friendly although unfortunately clueless.
-This morning the executive lounge waiters were different, and actually very friendly and efficient. Unfortunately, there were loads of kids and it wasn't a quiet experience, however this isn't the hotel's fault. The breakfast is OK, not too many choices though nothing missing. The pastries are also nice. The evening alcohol is rather poor in terms of wines, did not see any champagne. Beer was the Japanese brands and was to my liking.

Like I mentionned before, my complaints about the food were in terms of the main dish which was taken up by the people in the lounge very quickly. Probably just some very hungry people Although, it doesn't explain the waiters not understanding my request for a plate (they were out of them) then just hunching about it. One of the girls talked to a couple of Americans who congratulated her on her English, although she had a little trouble replying, although in Japanese style was friendly and that made up for her shortcomings. That pretty much sums up the hotel: they will understand most requests but anything a bit special or out of the common is more difficult for them to cope with. Whether you get attitude with that or not depends on the person.

The Westin could be a very nice property if the manager just got the training right, were more responsive and addressed the service shortcomings. Otherwise, the concierge and room maids were extremely efficient and surprised me compared to the other aspects.

I'm back at the Hyatt now, and the service there is really attentive and perfect, the way I had imagined the Westin would be.

b8b

You got robbed. Sorry m8.

Indeed, except for the old lady in the kimono (sp?), avoid her at all expense - I spoek with another FT'er while here (I'm still here) and he said he would report her to the GM - she makes you feel like awful for asking any question (we joked that she must have some dirt on the GM, lolz).
[/QUOTE]

I didn't got that far on the floor, it's quite possible it could be awful - when I first walked into my room I could swear it smelled like smoke. There must be some G8 activity as there was a cop stationed outside the hotel road entrance today.

I apologize, I should have mentioned that your exec lounge cert also gives you buffet breakfast privileges on the secon dfloor in Aqua Blue, which I also informed (too late) to the other FT'er here who enjoyed that on his last two mornings. Night and day difference. The mango juice yesterday was incredible, and the apple juice (they rotate out a few juices daily) was also quite good and seemed fresh-pressed.

The wine is hit or miss. They had a great Riesling for the white wine selection when we first got here, but they ran out (quickly). Tonight the red was an amazing '04 Shiraz - otherwise, they are mediocre at best.

I concur. This could be an incredible property, but they just fall short on a few. I used extra points and additional points upon arrival to get a Luxury sweet (kids in tow) and it has a single shower head, another FT'er with a JR suite has a better bathroom setup, there are only 14 channels on the TV and only 1 subtitled in English (CNN international), and the bed is hard as a rock - I asked for some down pillows to sleep on, they would only give me regular ones. I asked for two fans yesterday for some white noise for us, I only got one (put it in the living room to keep the kids asleep - it worked! I got an hour and a half extra sleep!!) heh).

I didn't get the PC password but I have the exec lounge wi-fi password and will post it later (along with a better review) if I can find it again.

I can't be more angry about the shuttle. It's been full twice and they made us wait 30 minutes for the next one without so much as a real apology (IMO, they should have paid for a cab for us). We've missed the last shuttle twice by a few minutes (the last one runs at 6:30 PM from Kyoto Station, even though other hotels have shuttles running much later) and they will drop you off at two places in between the Westin and Kyoto Station but will NOT pick you back up there due to some silly Japanese law enacted as of June 1, 2008 (or something). Today, we quite literally missed the last shuttle by two minutes. $17 cab ride back or subway (that's twice now), and we didn't beat the shuttle

GVA: sorry I missed you, it would have been nice to meet you.